I believe my non-believer friends will understand this.
Roy No, they don’t. Just because that’s your belief that atheists believe something, or any other person, doesn’t make your belief true. I’m not an atheist, so I can’t fall into your viewpoint. I believe that I am the product of a multi-dimensional Universal Consciousness that placed my own personal spirit, consciousness or whatever you want to call it, into this human system that evolved over millions of years into the living being it is today.
Larry Marshall Your “own personal spirit” did it evolve over millions of year or did it evolve from that point in time that you “became aware.”
Roy It has existed since before time began as has the Universal Consciousness of which we are all a part
Larry Marshall Yes, God has been and always will be.
Roy Pretty sure you’re just projecting your beliefs onto others as is the christian way
- April 23 at 4:03pm
Larry Marshall A logical fallacy in your above statement-how can something exist before “time began.” It sounds a lot like God whom created time and the universe as we know it.
- April 25 at 6:24pm
Samuel Before saying I believe that, I would want to study the evidence that suggests I’m an accident more closely.
- April 23 at 1:01am
Larry Marshall Evolution, Samuel, evolution. There is no design to it, it happened by random chance or accident as it may well be that they compounds came together into a living system strictly by accident.
April 23 at 12:01pm
Roy As appoaed to magic?
- April 23 at 12:26pm
Larry Marshall As by an Intelligent Designer. It is mathematically impossible for the number of chemical bounds to have occurred to create atheists out of amoebas even if given ten times the amount of time normally assumed for evolution to have occurred.
April 23 at 3:26pm
Roy Subjective belief based on need
- April 23 at 4:06pm
Larry Marshall I have no need for a subjective belief, my belief is eternal
- April 23 at 6:15pm
Ronald -Roy – no magic. Just a designer. It’s amazing that a simple watch is seen and no one, not one person, would think it was made by accidental circumstances. Look at the Mouse Trap that only has a few moving parts and you know it was made by a designer. But look at a human being as complex as we are, as complex as one cell is, and you are willing to believe that we are here by accident. How did it all begin? Where did the “chemicals” come from that got together and started this great universe of ours? Atheists know that there are at least 25 questions left unanswered. Haeckel’s drawings proven to be frauds, Nebraska man – they found only a tooth, Piltdown man – human skull and lower jaw of an orangutan, Cro-Magnon – found to be fully human now…
- April 23 at 4:18pm
Roy Belief is irrefutable for believers. My belief in the Univesal Consciousness fulfills mine
- April 23 at 4:21pm
Larry Marshall But what is the Universal Consciousness? How did it develop? When, where did it come from? How does one become one with it? Can you use your UC?
Roy For lack of a better word, the UC is god. It is everything, You don’t become part of the UC or Mother Earth, Your existence is because the UC split, Vanity, the ultimate sin caused the split, and those in the splinter UC have felt the need to return and so must pass seven trials. This is number three. Sorry you didn’t read my novel when it was posted on my blog. It detailed our existence in an entertaining method and gave answers to all questions. My belief system is such that I am acutely aware of my existence, my part in the living Mother Earth, what happens when this body expires and the big one, are ya ready, why we are all here. the things I do in my life, meditation, stopping my internal dialogue, listen to the signs from my Mother, all give me verification that my beliefs are true. I enjoy our debates, I do the same with my friends from the cigar store, people who try to convert me to their beliefs and to all who pray for me. And the fun thing is, my system is not so different than yours, it just is more all encompassing. There is no answer to what is the UC just as there is none for where did your god come from. There is simply an acknowledgement that it is.
- April 23 at 7:16pm ·
Larry Marshall “Ishvarah param Krishna, sachidanand vigraha; anadir adir Govinda, sarva karana karanam.” or in English “Krishna who is known as Govinda is the supreme Godhead. He has an eternal omniscient blissful spiritual body. He is without beginning and He is the origin of all. He has no other origin and He is the prime cause of all causes.”
Sehgal B.Tech IIT Delhi, Vimal (2010-02-02). Creation vs. Evolution – The Vedic Perspective (Kindle Locations 403-404). . Kindle Edition.
All I needed to do was to accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior and “I am acutely aware of my existence, my part in the living Mother Earth, what happens when this body expires and the big one, are ya ready, why we are all here.” But I get that knowledge through the study of all that is around me. I read many parts of your novel, but just could not get into it- not my cup of tea as written.
- April 24 at 2:46pm
Roy Yeah. It was long. Working with friend to make thtee act play ti produce locally
April 24 at 4:42pm
Ronald Roy, you still need to answer where “everything” came from. It didn’t make itself. And how can the created (man, trees, the earth, etc) be the same as the creator?
- Apri 24 at 4:44pm
Roy Where everything came from. Hmmmm, an interesting concept. Light is my answer. Everything is composed of light. Yes, solid matter is in its most basic form. Where and how does the bible explain “where everything came from” That’s the magic part of an answer from several days ago. For me there is no creator, there is the UC.
April 25 at 6:57am
Ronald Light? And living organisms came from this light? Something is not scientific there. Can’t put my finger on it…
- April 2 at 12:38pm
Roy All right, drug back in again after I said I wouldn’t. In the earliest findings in science there were the advances that led to discovering protons, neutrons, and electrons. As they learned more, the particles they found that make up the above three pieces have become smaller and smaller. The Higgs Bozon the newest and smallest. Can scientists see photons of light. I mean other than the effect of striking the receptors in your eye? Cayce explained how in the beginning all that existed was consciousness, and light. No, not even time. Time is a construct of this plane of existence and was necessary to exist within the parameters needed to learn whilst in this plane. At this time, we do not even know if time exists in the other six planes, or what they are constructed of or even if we would be able to see, understand or exist within any of the other planes. Here, we learn Balance. And not doing such a great job of it. However, I have begun to learn, to accept what I can perceive through observation and to write about it so others if they desire can learn how to see those same things. I do not pray to my Universal Consciousness hoping that you, my brother or any other individual consciousness believes as I do. You can do whatever you want except hurt others, wage war, destroy the planet, rape children, steal, lie, cheat kill and eat people (Dahmer reference) and then jump up and down and go hey, I’m sorry I did that and now I accept the mystic and magical concept of the christ figure into my heart and I’m saved. It don’t work that way. For lack of a better explanation of how living in the UC, see Karma, it’s as good an explanation as one can get and very similar to the teachings of Cayce, who gave his wisdom freely and doesn’t live in a multimillion dollar castle and fly around in his private jet claiming to help the believers if they send him money. Well, in reality, lucre. So, yeah, light. How do we know that next year they will breakdown the stuff of existence and discover that indeed, matter is just light, waiting to do as commanded by, for lack of a better term, god. In my belief, the UC.
- April 27 at 1:18pm
Larry Marshall The Higgs Boson is a particle that would provide weight to all other particles. https://larryemarshall.wordpress.com/2013/03/13/higgs-boson/
Roy Larry Marshall Yes, it is. Just recently discovered. What makes up the lepton, the quarks and who knows what they will discover next year. Light. There is no science, no religion, no all knowing seer that can say with absolute certainty that science will not draw that conclusion someday. No one knows. Just like scientists telling us the wonders of Thalidomide, PCB, DDT and innumerable other advances that over time, were dicsovered to be wrong. For the most part, science admits to errors, I will leave it at that. …. So not sure if that makes my explanation any ,,,, clearer. I did say that right now, science can’t see what we, tell you is reality. But it is observable, and in that action, varifiable. . . so read your blog and you draw the same religious conclusions as always. Everything is made up of 24 parts, therefore it was designed by the creator. .. An interesting conclusion, it’s called faith.
- April 27 at 3:38pm
April 28 at 1:59pm
Ronald It takes more faith to believe that something came from nothing than to believe in a creator.
April 29 at 9:28am
Ronald Roy – you say you can do whatever you want except hurt others, wage war, destroy the planet….etc. I’m sure there are “moral” atheists, but it will have to be using their definition of moral. So if they decide that stealing is justified because they need it, who is to tell them they are wrong? If they decide that killing a baby just before it’s born is justified, who is there to tell them they are wrong? You might say, “the law”. Well, what if all the lawmakers were atheists and created laws justifying their actions?
May 1 at 10:39am
Roy So isn’t the christian view of morality defined by christians? If you do bad things it’s because you lack empathy not morality
May 1 at 10:54am
Samuel The Christian argument of morality is so weak I’m surprised anyone even brings it up. Ronald, Larry said you’re a scholar but you’re arguing like a rather dim individual.
Yesterday at 12:11am
Roy Ron, who is there to tell the priests that molestation of their young members is wrong? Is what joel osteen doing wrong? Is bombing birth control clinics and killing innocent people wrong? Is the belief that pretty much you can do anything you want in this life, murder, cheat others, steal, vandalize and whatever, but just before you die you can you can accept a biblical concept of the christ into your heart, ask forgiveness, and all is good, isn’t that wrong? Where’s the morality there? Living in the knowledge that the Universal Consciousness is a part of me, knowing that my actions in this life, every action, have consequences throughout my existence, this life and the next ones means that I am a very moral man. I have to be, I don’t get the proverbial all is forgiven come live in heaven freebie that christians seem to get in life. I pay for my sins in Karma now, in the next life, and in my striving to achieve Oneness.
Yesterday at 12:40am
Larry Marshall All right, morality in the Christian community is defined by the Ten Commandments and I do not believe that anyone would argue that they are not a good basis for morality. Organized religion is at fault for giving many nonbelievers the thought that we can sin and then ask for forgiveness and every thing is hunky-dory. Roy, we have discussed this in the past and you still can’t get over it. In Christianity we ask God to forgive us of our sins and then we change our lives to live more like him and to ‘sin no more.’ Doesn’t mean we are successful at it all the time, but that is what we strive for. And yes, that does mean that some individuals can be mean and commit crimes while hiding behind a ‘righteous’ life. Same as nonbelievers, they be donate to charities, say all the right things in public and beat their wife and children in the privacy of their own home. The point about morality is that we have a solid basis for it with the Bible, nonbelievers have a morality that is based upon changing mores and social values. Not always anything wrong with it, but it does have a potential for abuse- more so than in the Christian world in theory. Not everyone follows the rules all the time no matter what your belief or non-belief. which just means that we are all sinners and fall short of the glory of God.
Yesterday at 7:56am
Roy Yeah, seems we disagree once more. My belief system doesn’t forgive me, doesn’t allow for me to hide anything. My existence is the sum total of all that I have done and will do and Karma punishes in one way or another in this life or the next. There is no forgiveness. I believe you have a rather simplistic view of non-christians when you say they have no basis for morality other than changing social values. The problem with that thought is that changing morals are pretty much based on the religious concepts that overwhelm the majority of the populace still to this day. Our founding fathers weren’t christian for the most part, they were deists and believed in the biblical existence and the system of government was designed to incorporate the morality of their time based on biblical morals. Anyone raised in this American society is subjected to those moral principles all their lives. And sorry, but think about what you just wrote, whatever you do, you can ask god for forgiveness. And in your world that’s the ultimate judge and jury for your world. And poof, forgiveness granted, go out and TRY again. —- The big question then becomes this, does having that all forgiving morality ingrained into the lives of mainstream existence have the effect of causing the breakdown of society? I believe that the answer is yes. Again, any that believe can sin, can lie cheat steal even kill and as long as you can receive that forgiveness than you get the opportunity to try try again. Forgiveness, No consequences for your poor decisions unless you’re caught by the governing body for actions against the laws based on biblical morals, which allow for forgiveness. ie. parole, pardon, monetary fines etc. See the difference, I know, I KNOW that every action that I take in my life has consequences. EVERY THING I do, good or bad affects my existence. I have morals that fucking believers wish they had when they die and meet their maker.
Yesterday at 8:35am
Ronald Roy – you have subjected to calling me names. No surprise there. If you want to seriously discuss matters, I’m fine with that. Otherwise, I will do you the favor of remaining out of the discussion. Seems to me you don’t like to be challenged.
Roy I’m sorry Ronald, I’m unaware that I called you any names. Unless you identify with those that as I stated, lie cheat steal murder then ask for forgiveness in order to go out and try again. Whereas you and my brother have repeatedly told me I’m wrong, compared me to his times hallucinating and unable to understand when you both say something then later tell me you never did. So, if I did call you a name, I apologize. If you’re just incapable of the truthful and accurate criticism of your faith, as you want me to be, then I’m not sorry, that’s all on you.
Larry Marshall All wrong Roy “Pretty sure you’re just projecting your beliefs onto others as is the christian way” Christians don’t project our beliefs on others- it is and always has been your right to reject the truth (granted as we see it) and believe in whatever turns you on. We will continue to pray for you in the hopes that reality is a part of the Universal Consciousness, because as they say “Reality Bites.”
April 23 at 6:23pm
Roy Ah, the pray for me line. Not projecting your beliefs onto me at all.
- April 23 at 7:07pm
Ronald If you believe that by Larry praying it projects on you, then you believe in the power of prayer. It’s that simple.
April 24 at 4:45pm
Larry Marshall Your pride and prejudice is showing Roy something that I thought was gone when you reach the UC. You believe and have said that you wish the best for others. That is all that I wish for you when I say I pray for you. Of course, I wish that you would follow the one true God, but I’m just asking our Lord to bless you in your endeavors.
April 24 at 7:25pm
Roy wow, it’s like you don’t even think about what you say. It’s so ingrained in your belief system, prayers for the heretic, if we believe and command you through prayer then I will see the world as you do. == you don’t reach the UC Larry, we are all a part of it. We are all connected as conscious beings living here in this third plane of existence. We are all individuals, we have pride, we have prejudices, we think individually not collectively. That’s why you have a belief in YOUR one true god just as do the LDS, the Muslims, the Jews, the Hari Krishnas, the Ba’hai, the, well everyone. The difficulties come when you all want your one true god to rule the heavens and as you say, to bless me in my endeavors. And all those other guys, what about them and their one true god. See, that’s the problem. I know in my soul that the UC exists, it has no power over me, my existence here on this, our Living Mother Earth is dependent on what I do, what I say and how I live my life. My mistakes are mine, I can’t get forgiveness for them,
- April 25 at 7:14am
Roy Doesn’t it bother you that in your religion Jeffrey Dahmer accepted Christ into his heart before he was killed in prison and he now lives amongst the blessed in heaven even after having killed and eaten all those people?
Ronald Roy – why do you think so many seek a god? Another question would be where do you think consciousness came from? It certainly didn’t evolve from anything since there is no known benefit to have one. And about Jeffrey Dammer – he made choices. So? It’s not a reflection on other Christians, is it? We don’t judge all people by the actions of one, do we?
- April 25 at 11:49am
Roy Ron, I think you are not in any way understanding what it is that I believe. My consciousness did not evolve. In the beginning there was consciousness, and everything was made of light. Separate, but all one. You and I cannot begin to understand the UC because just like i cannot tell you what happens to me when I stop my internal dialogue, there is no common experience with which to express a concept that you could understand. That is not meant to be derogatory, it is just a fact. No human can understand the UC, we can talk about it and try, but the actual knowledge of what we came from is not possible. When I stop my ID I glimpse the UC as it is. And there again, I can’t explain it to you, you have no idea what I experience cuz you ain’t done it. Mortal men for hundreds of thousands of years have done just that and the shamanistic world of ancient cultures have all given us glimpses into the reality of our existenc within the UC. I can’t tell you why any person seeks god. Every person thinks differently and processes what we learn from our Mother Earth individually. Food for thought though, you weren’t born a christian, you learned it, as you learned all of your vices, prejudices, hatreds and fears. I discovered my beliefs, they exist there on Mother Earth waiting for each of us to find, as have open minded men since time immorial.
- April 25 at 1:04pm
Larry Marshall Ron, back in the day I used to call that hallucinations and a good or bad trip depending upon the party situation.
- April 25 at 4:19pm
Roy Yeah. Because you’re right, all else that you won’t attempt to understand, is beneath contempt and stock for jokes. I can’t say I’m surprised, in a way I do the same. Christianity does get it’s fair share of jokes and jabs, because of the straight laced no delineation from what the bible says rigid beliefs of those unable to accept that there might be something BETTER than what you have had shoved into your minds. I can go on and on about how simple explorations of what ancient peoples have observed for millennia would open your mind to a differing paradigm about the universe. But, closed minds won’t try, sadly, so much of the world follows in your beliefs. They all want to be right, they all want the world to believe as they do. And vehemently claim that isn’t so while your very words show me the truth in that statement that you deny so so much. It was fun, this is the last post for me on this, once again I got caught up in a funny response to one of your incredibly stupid and illogical postings and it has deteriorated into you claiming I’m stoned because I believe what I can see with my own eyes as have many many wise men before me. It isn’t new ideas, the Dineh from who I learned much of this, Edgar Cayce, who defined the UC even though you claim he is weird psychic with no credibility. Which why would you or anyone believe what is outside the comfort zone of the magic of your lives. As I stated before, I understand your beliefs, mine just make sense as well as being verifiable to anyone that wants to try. I guess that’s the problem, it isn’t easy, it isn’t the same old same old spoon fed pablum of easily digestible stories of magic from bronze age goat herders that you all act as if it is the never once altered and changed in any way words as spoken two thousand years ago. Oh well, thanks for making me realize how closed minded you are and believing that I am having hallucinations as did the men and women back in the day the bible was written. Oh yeah there is that part of reality, mold on grains that caused such things that never ever seems to enter into the reality based book of magic that is in fact the Gospel as told , well, who cares.
- April 25 at 5:36pm
Larry Marshall I didn’t claim you were stoned, I told Ron that the what you were describing was what I would call hallucinations back in the day. You seem to jump to personal conclusions really fast. And as far as closed minds go, the indifference which you dismiss the reverent beliefs of others as if your belief system is the one true way. You have created your eternal belief and it is certainly unique to you.
Ronald “Roy has left the building”. Why is it that they first throw insults and then stop defending their position?
April 27 at 11:42am
Larry Marshall It does seem to be a common occurrence.
- April 27 at 2:10pm
Ronald Well, it pisses me off! Is it that they can’t defend their position that they resort to name calling and then storm off?
April 28 at 1:24pm
Larry Marshall I’ve just accepted it as a fact. When they get tongue tied trying to debate logic and fact with their same mistaken preconceived notions, they just stop.
- April 28 at 4:58pm
Roy the bible, logic and fact. Okay.
April 28 at 8:01pm
Roy Well, the jabs are from both sides
Ron “something is not scientific there. Can’t put my finger on it.”
Larry “All wrong Roy”
Larry “I wish that you would follow the one true God”
Larry “I used to call that hallucinations”
Larry “indifference which you dismiss the reverent beliefs of others as if your belief system is the one true way”
Larry ” they get tongue tied trying to debate logic and fact with their same mistaken preconceived notions, they just stop.”
And truthfully, I did write some words about the reality of faith in the bible on several occasions. But it’s all true. However that said, I have never said that you’re faith is wrong as others have told me. I’ve said it before, everyone needs faith. I have mine, it’s verifiable if one tries. You and so many others seem to think, and you even expressed such, that by praying for me, I will see the light of what you believe. And, the sad thing is, your faith blinds you to anything else, other faiths, belief that atheists aren’t moral, or the simple realization that anyone else in the world thinks and believes in some form of faith and since it isn’t your faith, it’s wrong. This whole thing started because of a silly meme Larry posted. An accident is probably correct, if you think three billion years of atoms and molecules forming under conditions that we as humans living NOW cannot ever explain. But as written, accident could mean many many things. And realistically, my belief in the UC means that yes, the basics for intelligent life were formed so that this planet, these life forms and intelligent beings could evolve. As I stated before, time is a construct for this Plane of Existence and as far as we know does not exist elsewhere in the UC. So who’s right in our beliefs. Only time will tell.
Anyway, I stopped responding before because although I did smoke weed in my late teens, I never did any drugs, have never hallucinated by using any substance and would never. I dislike those that do and am greatly offended when my confirmation process of my beliefs are compared to hallucinations.
April 28 at 8:01pm
Ronald Roy – you sound skeptical. Do you know of any part of the Bible that has been proven wrong? Many have tried, but in their research have ended up becoming Christians.
April 29 at 9:32am
Roy I don’t understand the question Ron, How do you prove an historical telling of fictional accounts of Messianic tellings of fables as being wrong? How do you prove them right as well? It’s faith. Again, we all need faith. Even atheists, its just that I have no idea what their faith is, but I know they have it, it’s ingrained in our consciousness. Faith that tomorrow the sun will rise, that when they die, they will be freed from the tyranny of a life they hate, oppressive government or wives or whatever. My faith is in what others have written about as told to them by a seer. (sounds familiar doesn’t it?) and sprinkled with details and experiences of Native Americans and when I do that one simple thing, stopping my Internal Dialogue, I actually see the truth, It ain’t so hard to believe then. It all makes sense. My brother has had several blogs, I used to read them, The circular logic wherein he points out specific bible passages as being unassailable because they are proven correct by another biblical passage that shows us this one specific passage that he wants to show as the gospel and so it is, was just too much for me. There is no science backing up what I believe, There is observational affirmation of my faith and belief. I can’t do the research to prove the bible is wrong because I don’t care. As I stated before, you can believe whatever you want, unless you hurt Mother Earth or other people. Then we have a problem. I have a belief system that works for ME and thousands of others that put forth the effort to explore their own minds and how we has humans exist in this plane.
April 29 at 9:51am
Samuel Larry, I feel like you’re a Sith Lord with the Empire and I am a Jedi with the Resistance.
- April 26 at 9:43am
Samuel For me the issue isn’t believing man is an accident. The issue is that Christianity and all other theistic belief systems are complete frauds. I don’t know if mankind is an accident but it’s painfully obvious that Christianity and other religions are total fiction.
April 28 at 3:10pm
Ronald one Samuel – I would stop looking at man for the answers. Our Bible teaches that man will let you down every time.
April 29 at 9:29am
Samuel The Bible is man made.
- April 29 at 10:00am
Samuel Maybe that’s why the Bible is such a let down…
April 29 at 10:02am
Susan The Bible was penned by men but the men were led by the Holy Ghost! If you really read the Bible you will see that so many things have come to pass that the Bible warns us about!
April 29 at 11:56am
Samuel Susan, give an example, lets see how overwhelming the Bible is.
April 29 at 12:57pm
Larry Marshall https://iamnotanatheist.wordpress.com/…/nt-to-ot…/ References in Old Testament fulfilled in New Testament.
The non-believers have a tendency to want to nit-pick the Bible into parts without ever…
- April29 at 1:52pm
Larry Marshall Samuel I don’t believe you’ve responded to the responses I gave you on our last lengthy discussion. on No Such Thing as Resurrection.
April 29 at 2:03pm
Ronald Samuel – Look at 2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is God breathed.
April 30 at 9:55am
Ronald Also, about it being “man made”….does that mean it’s not true? Is that what you want us to infer by the fact that it is considered “man made”?
Larry Marshall Samuel, the fraud is in atheism that has no belief or morality system to base itself upon. It is what is made up to cover a lack of faith in anything but themselves.
April 28 at 5:00pm
Larry Marshall https://youtu.be/aA-FcnLsF1g
- April 28 at 7:22pm
Samuel See this circle. This is the argument you guys are using.
- April 30 at 10:24am
Larry Marshall That is not what I use to prove the Bible. I take the non-believers criticisms and then through logic and facts tear about their mistaken belief. Sometimes I will use further scripture to highlight a point, but I do not use the Bible to prove the Bible although that is easy to do also, but the problem is you folks won’t believe it, so I take the alternate route of discrediting what you folks write.
April 30 at 1:33pm
Roy Marshall I’m not sure what to think about this comment. There were no logic, no facts about your criticism of my and my beliefs. In fact you compared my ability to view the Universal Consciousness to hallucinations when you did drugs. And granted I have not looked at your new blog much, but your old one, you did that exact thing time and again. I’m not sure if you don’t recognize it because of, well, personal reasons, or that you are so ingrained in the concept of your bible that you don’t RECOGNIZE that’s what you did. Again, I’m just too busy to read your new blog and verify that you no longer do it, so from that standpoint, i am ignorant. However, as I stated, if you want to believe, fine, just don’t claim as you have, that your belief is based on facts. nor please don’t in one sentence tell me you pray for me to become as you believe then deny that statement in a later posting
April 30 at 7:09pm
Samuel Larry Marshall, you provided a link of New Testament to Old Testament references. That IS a “the bible is true because the bible says the bible is true” argument!
April 30 at 2:12pm
Larry Marshall No, that doesn’t prove anything, other than how one passage of prophecy is fulfilled in the New Testament and when individuals mentioned in the New Testament referred to statements made in the Old Testament. Doesn’t prove anything about the Bible’s accuracy, just highlights the number of cross- references.
April 30 at 3:30pm
Larry Marshall Not all circular reasoning is fallacious. Certain standards must be assumed. Here is an example of a non-arbitrary use of circular reasoning:
1. Without laws of logic, we could not make an argument.
2. We can make an argument.
3. Therefore, there must be laws of logic.
While this argument is circular, it is a non-fallacious use of circular reasoning. Since we can not prove anything apart from the laws of logic, we must presuppose the laws of logic even to prove they exist. In fact, if someone were trying to disprove that laws of logic exist, he’d have to use the laws of logic in his attempt, thereby refuting himself.
- April 30 at 6:18pm
Roy Larry Marshall re cross references and the NT proving the OT was a valid work, Well, that’s how it was written.
- May 1 at 8:11am
Larry Marshall The Bible is primarily concerned with the Person and nature of God, and His interactions with humanity in creation and redemption. But this description of the Bible’s purpose means that it has to have a lot of historical content; i.e., “the Bible purports to record a chronicle of real events from the ancient Near East, against which backdrop the revelation of God was communicated. The work of Yahweh in the OT is depicted as being a part of history itself.” (Walter Kaiser, Jr. A History of Israel: From the Bronze Age Through the Jewish Wars, Broadman & Holman, Nashville, 1998, p. 3) And wherever the Bible has made a specific historical claim, it has been shown to be correct where external corroborating evidence exists.
May 1 at 9:30am
Roy Yes. That’s how it was written. It was chronicled rewritten translated and compiled millenia after the events.
May 1 at 10:06am
Roy You can call it a factual record of events however just as has happened throughout history, the victor in this case christianity, writes the hjstory books as they want
May 1 at 10:08am
Ronald Atheist believe in evolution and they use circular reasoning. There are several types of circular reasoning found in support of evolutionary theory. One of these is the geological dating position that “fossils are dated by the type of stratum they are in, while at the same time the stratum is dated by the fossils found in it.” An alternative evolutionarily statement is that “the fossils and rocks are interpreted by the theory of evolution, and the theory is proven by the interpretation given to the fossils and rocks.”
Samuel Atheists believe in evolution?
Larry Marshall You certainly do not believe in a creationist view of the universe. So what would you call your belief in how we all came to be?
Samuel I don’t know how we all came to be.
- 5 mins
Samuel Ronald also used the circular argument by referencing the 2 Timothy verse.
- April 30 at 2:13pm
Larry Marshall Ron is a biblical scholar and I wish I knew it as well as he does. That verse states that the Bible is the inspired word of God. I have no doubt that Ron can list several dozen others that verify the same belief. I however, would use a variety of other factors and items to prove that the verse means what it says. Again, Samuel William Delisle I don’t believe you’ve responded to the postings I gave you on our last lengthy discussion. on No Such Thing as Resurrection.
April 30 at 3:34pm
Samuel Larry Marshall, people do not lie dead for three days and then get up. You know this. I know this. There’s no need to debate the supossed resurrection.
April 30 at 3:40pm
Larry Marshall Today, yes people do not return to life. However, God has the power to work outside of the normal limits of what we believe to be reality and Jesus who was God incarnate was risen from the dead, just as Jesus also raised Lazarus. It is a fair subject to debate. You provide me several references that attempted to prove you disbelief and I read them and found a series of logical errors and misconceptions and wrote several blog postings explaining what is fallacious with them. So am I to assume you can not offer counter arguments to the facts I presented?
- April 30 at 5:46pm
Samuel Just got back from the Paul McCartney concert! What an amazing show! Definitely too happy right now to debate religion!!
May 1 at 12:45am ·
Larry Marshall Never did like the Beetles, thought they were just the best studio band ever. George Harrison was my favorite within the group and as a solo artist. Paul, yes he is good but in my mind he writes formula songs. I’ve seen that he does put on a good show. Glad you enjoyed it.
May 1 at 9:39am
Bruce Okay I’m chime in and say that mankind as we know it is an accident and religion from the beginning of history have tried to write stories explaining it. 1st there is the Phoenicians, then the Greeks, the Romans, and the Egyptians all which Judiasm and Christianity stole from to make there all perfect religion. That’s not taking into account the far east religions and to take spoken word for 100’s of years and finally right it down is absurd to think that is the true word of God. Then there is this whole concept of denying truth in science and bending it to fit Fundamental religion is just asinine and ludicrous on a scale that the Free thinkers laugh. So no I don’t see mankind as an accident I see Earth as we know it a prime location in which life can thrive as science has dictated. An furthermore if anyone think we are alone out there look around are galactic neighbors we are finding several earth type planets in the habitable zone of several stars upwards of 10 a year are being discovered but, in the end Fundamentalist will argue that it can’t be true because only one God and one image he has made himself into in mankind. What they fail to realize is the speed of light and if the nearest star Alpha Centari where to have powerful enough telescope they would see Dinosaurs roaming the earth something that doesn’t fit into that precious Bible
- May 1 at 12:11pm
Samuel Bruce Monroe made you Christians look a bit silly!
May 1 at 1:47pm
Bruce To deny fact is to deny life…find that in your stolen Scripture
May 1 at 1:48pm
Ronald Dinosaurs do fit in the Bible. The behemoth and the leviathan come to mind. I hope I spelled those correctly.
- 2 hrs
Bruce Those are considered mythological beast at best
Ronald Your source of info on that is…….?
Ronald “First were the Phoenicians”? That’s 1,500 BC. Is that the first civilization in your world?